Paul Dawson is a longtime Needham resident who also happens to manage the Highland Avenue properties known as Bertucci’s Plaza — likely to become colloquially known as Conrad’s Plaza when that restaurant opens its doors in the very near future.
As director of asset management for the Grossman Companies, the manager of the plaza, he has monitored the MBTA zoning process but chooses not to weigh in on the merits of what is being proposed, even though the property he manages lies in the heart of the proposed new zoning overlay district.
Grossman has managed the site since 2017. It is currently fully leased with seven tenants, and the Conrad’s lease runs through 2038, according to documents filed with the state Alcoholic Beverages Control Commission for the restaurant’s alcohol license.
The plaza consists of two separate parcels but Dawson said, “We look at it as a unified property.”
Like any commercial property manager, he said Grossman gives occasional thought to alternative plans but Dawson said there’s nothing remotely imminent and there’s no sense of urgency, even with an MBTA-related zoning change possibly in the offing.
An architect by training, he did indicate he was bemused but a bit taken aback by the one rendering of what new zoning might allow the property to become. It is an image that has been featured prominently in the advocacy of Needham Residents for Thoughtful Zoning, whose efforts have put a repeal of the zoning passed by Town Meeting on the Jan. 14 special election ballot.
“I was a little surprised by that,” Dawson said of the rendering, which depicts a single four-story mass running essentially from May Street to the plaza on both sides of the street.
“It shows the building as being much closer to the street than would be allowed and there’s no setback on the side,” he said. In fact, he noted, “the rendering depicts the building encroaching onto an adjoining property that we don’t even own or manage.
“We would not build within three feet of the sidewalk,” he said. “We would make something a lot less gloomy than what this looks like. We’re not into Gotham.”
He stressed that, given the long-term leases that are in place, there has been no planning to redevelop the site but noted that, given his company’s general approach on other projects, anything they might do “would be in the distant future and appropriate for Needham.”
As for what he thinks would work within the proposed MBTA zone, Dawson said he felt it was “very unlikely anyone would be designing units that would be desirable for families — in the sense of families with young children.”
He could see projects designed to attract two pools of potential tenants, perhaps in the same complex. “I don’t think it would be age-restricted, but by its very nature it would be geared more toward empty-nesters.
“The other pool, I think, would be youngish professionals.”
Two other real estate professionals agreed to discuss what MBTA zoning changes could make possible. They asked not to be named due to the intensity of the feelings in town around the issue.
A developer who has worked in Needham but has no connection to properties in the zoned area believes the provision of the MBTA law that allows development “by right” could accelerate the pace and scale of development, especially if a large developer with deep pockets should show interest.
They said the financial challenges posed by the cost of land acquisition in Needham are less daunting to deep-pocketed developers who would be able to absorb the upfront costs to create a consolidated site in return for long-term returns.
Those same upfront costs, they said, would be a deterrent to the relatively smaller firms that traditionally work in Needham and are perhaps better described as “builders.”
Both the larger developers and the builders will be attracted by the feature of the MBTA law that allows development to proceed “by right” — without being subjected to special permitting, which can require developers to address issues not related to the site, such as paying for traffic signals or parks.
The developer noted the basic cost to build apartments in Needham is not meaningfully different from other communities in the region. “But you can get a hell of a lot more rent in Needham,” they said.
Another building professional who is involved with properties in the planned zoning district was less bullish on the prospects of going large, or even medium, in Needham. The hurdle, they said, would be finding willing sellers or to convince current owners to take on the considerable risks associated with redevelopment.
Most of the commercial buildings in the area scheduled to be rezoned are fully leased, they noted. They have income coming in, leases they must abide by and the buildings are mostly bought and paid for.
They ask, somewhat rhetorically: “Why would you take a fully leased building and knock it down? Why would you then go years without rent? Then you assume the leasing risk and the construction risk.”
As for the MBTA law provision allowing building “by right,” they agreed it was a plus but not a free pass.
“It’s not opening the floodgates, let’s put it that way,” they said.
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